Understand and Use Dreams to Learn and Forget | Huberman Lab Essentials

Huberman Lab Essentials; Dreaming, Learning & Un-Learning (0s)

• The "Huberman Lab Essentials" series revisits past episodes to provide the most potent and actionable science-based tools for mental health, physical health, and performance (0s).
• Andrew Huberman, a professor of neurobiology and ophthalmology at Stanford School of Medicine, hosts the series (11s).
• The topic of discussion is dreaming, learning during dreaming, and unlearning during dreaming, particularly unlearning of challenging emotional events (17s).
• Many people throughout history have tried to make sense of dreams in an organized way, with Sigmund Freud being the most famous for his theory on symbolic representations in dreams (28s).
• Although some of Freud's theories have been debunked, there is still interest in understanding the symbols of dreaming (38s).
• The discussion will explore the topic of dreams and how to maximize the dream experience for learning and unlearning, but will not focus on Freudian theory (52s).

Types of Sleep (1m4s)

• As we get sleepy, our autonomic centers in the brain control the closing of the eyelids, and we transition into sleep, which is broken up into 90-minute cycles, also known as ultradian cycles (1m11s).
• Early in the night, these 90-minute cycles tend to be comprised more of shallow sleep and slow wave sleep, with less REM (Rapid Eye Movement) sleep (1m32s).
• For every 90-minute cycle, more and more REM sleep occurs, and less slow wave sleep, regardless of whether sleep is broken or not (1m46s).
• The more sleep one gets across the night, the more REM sleep they will have, and REM sleep and non-REM sleep have distinctly different roles in learning and unlearning (2m6s).
• REM sleep and non-REM sleep are responsible for learning and unlearning of distinctly different types of information, with implications for learning motor skills, unlearning traumatic events, and processing emotionally challenging or pleasing events (2m11s).
• Daytime activities can be leveraged to access more slow wave sleep or non-REM sleep, or more REM sleep, depending on one's emotional and physical needs (2m38s).

Slow-Wave Sleep, Motor Learning (2m57s)

• Slow-wave sleep, also known as non-REM sleep, is characterized by a specific pattern of brain activity, including large waves of activity that encompass a significant portion of the brain, and is metabolically active (3m1s).
• Neuromodulators, such as acetylcholine, norepinephrine, serotonin, and dopamine, play a crucial role in slow-wave sleep, influencing brain circuits and functions (3m26s).
• Acetylcholine, associated with focus and attention, is essentially absent during slow-wave sleep, while norepinephrine, linked to alertness and movement, is present but not as active as in waking states (4m26s).
• Serotonin, associated with feelings of bliss and stillness, is highly active during slow-wave sleep, which is consistent with the reduced movement observed during this stage (5m15s).
• Slow-wave sleep is primarily responsible for motor learning, including the consolidation of new motor skills, and the learning of specific details about events (5m57s).
• Research has shown that depriving individuals of slow-wave sleep can negatively impact motor learning, highlighting the importance of this stage in the learning process (5m41s).
• Slow-wave sleep typically occurs at the beginning of the night, and its role in motor learning and detail learning is most prominent during this time (5m8s).
• Although individuals are not paralyzed during slow-wave sleep, they tend not to move, except in cases of sleepwalking, which often occurs during this stage (5m27s).

Rapid Eye Movement (REM) Sleep, Paralysis, Unlearning of Emotional Events (6m54s)

• REM sleep, or Rapid Eye Movement sleep, occurs throughout the night but is more prevalent towards morning, comprising a larger percentage of 90-minute sleep cycles (6m54s).
• REM sleep was discovered in the 1950s when researchers observed people's eyes moving under their eyelids during sleep, with erratic movements in different directions (7m17s).
• The eye movements during REM sleep are not just side to side but also include rapid and jittery movements, which can be observed when eyelids are slightly open or pulled back (7m43s).
• The connections between the brainstem, pons, thalamus, and the top of the brainstem are involved in generating these eye movements, which are similar to conscious eye movements but occur without control (7m55s).
• During REM sleep, serotonin, a molecule associated with feelings of bliss and well-being, is essentially absent, and norepinephrine, a molecule involved in movement and alertness, is also absent (8m41s).
• Additionally, epinephrine, a molecule involved in fear and anxiety, is at zero activity during REM sleep, which has implications for the types of dreaming and learning that occur during this stage (9m1s).
• In REM sleep, the body is paralyzed, a state known as atonia, and dreams are experienced as hallucinations or hallucinatory activities (9m24s).
• The absence of epinephrine during REM sleep allows for the experience of emotionally laden events without the associated fear and anxiety, enabling the brain to process and consolidate memories (10m35s).
• This stage of sleep is crucial for learning and unlearning, as it allows the brain to replay and process events without the emotional attachment, leading to a dissociation of emotions from experiences (11m13s).

Lack of REM Sleep, Emotionality (11m21s)

• Slow wave sleep, which typically occurs early in the night, is important for motor learning and detailed learning (11m24s).
• REM sleep has a dream component characterized by the absence of epinephrine, resulting in the inability to experience anxiety, and often features vivid and detailed dreams (11m31s).
• The learning that occurs during REM sleep is not related to motor events, but rather the unlearning of emotional events (11m47s).
• The absence of chemicals that facilitate strong emotions during REM sleep allows for the unlearning of emotional components (11m55s).
• Lack of REM sleep can have significant implications, including increased emotional irritability and a tendency to catastrophize small things (13m18s).
• Laboratory studies have shown that selective deprivation of REM sleep can cause emotionality to become unhinged, leading to feelings of being overwhelmed and unable to move forward (13m31s).
• A common scenario where people may not get enough REM sleep is waking up in the middle of the night and being unable to fall back asleep, which can be mitigated by using a Non-Sleep Deep Rest (NSDR) protocol (12m30s).
• Getting REM sleep later in the night, after waking up and using a NSDR protocol, can still be beneficial for unlearning emotional components and reducing emotional irritability (13m5s).

REM Sleep, Learning & Meaning (13m54s)

• REM sleep involves the replay of certain types of spatial information about where we were and why we were in those places, which maps to the activity experienced during the day as we move from one place to another (13m54s).
• Studies initiated by Matt Wilson at MIT have shown that in rodents, non-human primates, and humans, there's a replay of spatial information during REM sleep that almost precisely maps to the activity experienced during the day (14m5s).
• When we experience new environments, such as navigating a new city or building, the information becomes solidified a few days later if it's important enough, and we won't forget it, but if it's unimportant, we'll probably forget it (14m40s).
• During REM sleep, there's a literal replay of the exact firing of the neurons that occurred while navigating the same city or building earlier (14m48s).
• REM sleep is involved in the generation of detailed spatial information and the formation of relationships with particular rules or algorithms, helping us figure out what's important and what's not (14m58s).
• REM sleep is also involved in the uncoupling of emotion and the establishment of meaning, which is how we individually piece together the relevance of one thing to the next (15m8s).
• Meaning is created by solidifying relationships between things and locations and how they fit together, and REM sleep is important for this process (15m41s).
• Depriving oneself of REM sleep can lead to seeing odd associations, hallucinations, and distorted perceptions of reality (16m38s).
• REM sleep helps establish the emotional load and discard irrelevant meanings, and a deficit in REM sleep can lead to overemotionality, catastrophizing, and unhealthy emotional and cognitive functioning (16m55s).

EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization & Reprocessing) Therapy, Trauma (17m46s)

• REM sleep appears to be the stage where the potential for emotionality between various experiences is uncoupled, which shares similarities with clinical practices designed to eliminate emotionality and help people move through trauma and other troubling experiences (17m46s).
• EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization Reprocessing) and ketamine treatment for trauma have features similar to REM sleep, and both are used to help people process traumatic experiences (18m29s).
• EMDR was developed by psychologist Francine Shapiro, who discovered that walking and recalling a troubling event reduced the emotional load of that experience, leading her to create a practice involving lateralized eye movements while recounting traumatic events (18m43s).
• In EMDR, clients move their eyes from side to side for 30 to 60 seconds while describing a challenging experience, which helps dissociate the emotional experience from the traumatic event (19m44s).
• The use of lateralized eye movements in EMDR is associated with the motor system and is similar to the reflexive, subconscious eye movements that occur when moving through space, such as walking or riding a bicycle (21m16s).
• Studies have shown that these lateralized eye movements help people move through or dissociate the emotional experience of particular traumas, allowing them to recall those experiences without feeling stressed (21m43s).
• Theories about why EMDR works include the idea that it mimics eye movements during REM sleep, but this has been proven false, and the concept of synchronizing activity between the two sides of the brain is also being reevaluated by modern neuroscience (20m35s).
• Studies have shown that lateralized eye movements, specifically moving the eyes from side to side with eyes open, can suppress the activity of the amygdala, a brain region involved in threat detection, stress, anxiety, and fear, and this technique has been successful in reducing traumatic experiences in a statistically significant number of people (22m5s).
• The amygdala is not a fear center, but it is critical for the fear response and the experience of anxiety, and some forms of fear are not amygdala-dependent (22m29s).
• The technique of using lateralized eye movements to suppress the amygdala is used in a clinical tool to help people overcome traumatic experiences, and it involves recounting or repeating the experience while suppressing the fear response to eventually uncouple the emotional load from the traumatic event (22m50s).
• It is not possible to completely forget a traumatic experience, but the emotional load associated with it can be removed, and over time, the experience loses its potency (23m24s).
• EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) is a therapy that uses lateralized eye movements to help people overcome traumatic experiences, and it is most successful for single event or specific kinds of trauma, rather than prolonged or complex trauma (23m36s).
• EMDR should be done in a clinical setting with a certified therapist and is not suitable for everyone, but it bears some resemblance to the experience of REM sleep, where the eyes move and memories are processed without the fear response (24m3s).
• During REM sleep, the eyes move in a different way, and the chemical epinephrine is not present to generate the fear response, allowing for the processing of memories without the emotional load (24m11s).

Ketamine Therapy, PCP, Trauma (24m25s)

• Ketamine is a dissociative anesthetic that bears resemblance to the effects of REM sleep and is being used as a chemical treatment to prevent the learning of emotions after trauma (24m25s).
• Ketamine is similar to the hazardous drug PCP and functions by disrupting the activity of the NMDA receptor in the brain, which is responsible for long-term potentiation and changes in neural connectivity (24m38s).
• The NMDA receptor is typically inactive but opens in response to extreme events, allowing the entry of molecules that trigger long-term potentiation and changes in neural connectivity (25m10s).
• Ketamine blocks the NMDA receptor, preventing the attachment of intense emotions to experiences, and is being used in emergency rooms to treat individuals who have experienced traumatic events (25m40s).
• Ketamine is not suitable for everyone and requires consultation with a physician, but it is being used to prevent the formation of traumatic memories by infusing individuals with ketamine soon after the traumatic event (26m6s).
• The use of ketamine raises ethical implications, as certain emotions need to be coupled with experiences, but in clinical settings, ketamine-assisted therapies aim to remove emotions by blocking plasticity and preventing the connection between emotions and experiences (26m26s).
• Ketamine is compared to other interventions, such as EMDR, which suppresses the amygdala and removes emotionality, and REM sleep, which prevents the signaling of intense emotions, highlighting an organizational logic that suggests certain components of sleeping life act like therapy (26m54s).
• REM sleep is thought to be a therapeutic process that prevents the formation of traumatic memories by blocking the chemical epinephrine, which allows for the signaling of intense emotions (27m6s).

REM Sleep as Therapy, Emotions (27m30s)

• REM sleep plays a crucial role in attaching emotions to particular experiences and ensuring that emotions are not attached to the wrong experiences, as well as unlearning emotional responses if they are too intense or severe (27m38s).
• Mastering sleep is essential, especially when life has disruptive events, to manage one's sleep life and allow for the unlearning of troubling emotions, which enables people to move forward in life (27m55s).
• REM deprivation studies have shown that people become hyper-emotional, start to catastrophize, and experience emotional and psychological disturbances, which is why sleep disturbances correlate with many emotional and psychological issues (28m26s).
• Sleep disturbances can impact emotionality, and research has shown that disruptions in temperature regulation during menopause can lead to changes in sleep regulation, affecting emotionality and the ability to adjust emotional circuits (29m9s).
• Dr. Sarah McKay's research on menopause in the brain suggests that many emotional effects of menopause are not directly related to hormones, but rather to changes in sleep regulation (28m55s).
• Sleep deprivation is not just a deprivation of energy or immune function, but also a deprivation of self-induced therapy that occurs during REM sleep every night (29m24s).
• REM sleep can be seen as a form of self-induced therapy, similar to clinical therapies like EMDR and ketamine, which highlights the importance of prioritizing sleep for emotional well-being (29m37s).

Tool: Improve Slow-Wave & REM Sleep (29m47s)

• Limiting the variation in the amount of sleep is at least as important as getting more sleep overall for learning new information, and consistently getting the same amount of sleep each night can be more beneficial than striving for a certain number of hours and varying around the mean (29m59s).
• Getting the full complement of slow wave sleep early in the night and REM sleep toward morning is ideal, with slow wave sleep being involved in motor learning and the acquisition of fine detailed information (30m25s).
• Drinking a lot of fluid right before going to sleep can disrupt sleep by causing the need to wake up and use the bathroom, as a full bladder triggers a neural connection that wakes the brain (30m42s).
• Consuming tryptophan or 5-HTP, which is a precursor to serotonin, can disrupt the timing of REM sleep and slow wave sleep, although it may work as a supplement for some people (31m2s).
• Engaging in resistance exercise is a powerful way to increase the percentage of slow wave sleep without disrupting other components of sleep and learning, as it triggers the release of growth hormone early in the night (31m26s).
• Resistance exercise does not have to be done close to bedtime and can be done at any time, unlike aerobic exercise which does not have the same effect on slow wave sleep (31m56s).
• Alcohol and marijuana can induce pseudo sleep-like states, disrupting the pattern, depth, and sequencing of sleep, including the natural progression from slow wave sleep to REM sleep (32m20s).
• Substances that increase serotonin or GABA, such as alcohol and THC, can disrupt the overall sequencing of sleep, including the natural progression from slow wave sleep to REM sleep (32m42s).

Recap & Key Takeaways (33m12s)

• A key aspect of sleep is the variation in slow wave sleep and REM sleep throughout the night, with more slow wave sleep and less REM early in the night, and more REM and less slow wave sleep later in the night (33m24s).
• REM sleep is associated with intense experiences without the presence of epinephrine, which allows for the uncoupling of emotions from experiences, effectively acting as a form of self-induced therapy (33m36s).
• REM sleep plays a crucial role in processing emotions, general themes, and meaning, while slow wave sleep is critical for motor learning and the learning of specific details (34m1s).
• The consistency of sleep is important, with getting a consistent amount of sleep each night being more beneficial than getting varying amounts of sleep each night (34m13s).
• Consistency in sleep can be more manageable than trying to sleep more, as it allows for better control over one's sleep schedule (34m25s).
• The mechanisms of sleep and wakefulness are complex and fascinating, and understanding them can provide valuable insights into how we function and who we are (34m35s).