Seth Godin's best tactics for building remarkable products, strategies, brands and more

Seth’s background (0s)

• Seth Godin is an author who has published 21 books, including 18 international bestsellers, and has been blogging every day for almost 10,000 days in a row (1m18s).
• He has founded several companies, including Yoyodyne and Squidoo, and started the altMBA program (1m46s).
• Godin began his career as a product manager and has shared wisdom and advice on various topics, including how ideas spread, when to quit, how to lead, and how to stand out (1m54s).
• He has inspired many people around the world with his writing and speaking, and his advice covers topics that everyone can benefit from (1m26s).
• Godin's new book, "This Is Strategy," discusses why every great strategy has tension at its center and how understanding the systems within which you operate is crucial for building a great strategy (2m11s).
• He emphasizes the importance of choosing your customers, distribution strategy, and validating your idea to inform the product you build and the life you live (2m21s).
• Godin used Claud as a writing assistant in developing his new book (2m27s).
• He shares advice on how to build a brand in an increasingly crowded world of AI startups and AI content, and discusses his thoughts on the Jaguar rebrand and the Tesla Cybertruck (2m2s).

Understanding good taste and upholding high standards (5m17s)

• Good taste is defined as knowing what other people want just before they do, and people with good taste bring something to the world that the world didn't necessarily expect but is glad to see (5m57s).
• Having good taste is not about personal preferences, but rather about understanding what others want, as seen in various fields such as jazz musicians or fabric designers (6m14s).
• To build good taste and higher standards, working with people who have high standards can be helpful, as it allows individuals to learn from them and improve their own standards (6m37s).
• Quality is not about luxury or perfection, but rather about meeting specifications, and having high standards means relentlessly improving those specifications to serve others (6m52s).
• Meeting specifications is not enough; high standards require continuous improvement of those specifications to delight the people being served (7m4s).
• The goal of having high standards is not to create something perfect, but to delight the person being served, and if that person is not delighted, it doesn't matter what excuses are made (7m47s).
• Having high standards means prioritizing the needs of others over personal preferences or pleasing one's boss, and those who do so can expect to be rewarded for their efforts (7m56s).

Become the best at whatever you do (8m9s)

• The idea that one can love and be amazing at their job, regardless of the type of job, is a powerful concept that originated from Reverend Martin Luther King Jr (8m29s).
• There is no perfect job that offers unlimited artistic freedom, but everyone has the ability to understand the boundaries of their work and strive to be the best within those limits (8m51s).
• Even in menial jobs, such as being a barista, one can choose to be the best at their job for a short period, like an hour, and find delight in adding joy to someone's day (9m8s).
• When individuals are given the freedom to add delight to their work, they can find personal fulfillment and enjoyment, regardless of their pay (9m27s).
• People can often tell when someone loves their job, even if it's not their long-term career goal, and this attitude can have a significant impact (9m37s).
• Embracing one's job and having fun with it can be a powerful way to approach work, as seen in individuals who choose to make the most of their situation (9m42s).

Seth’s journey as a product manager (9m48s)

• The origin story of a product manager's journey began with a summer job at Spinnaker Software, a company that invented educational computer games, where they were the 30th employee and worked as an assistant brand manager (10m13s).
• At the end of the summer, the company offered a secret project to work on while attending business school, which involved creating computer adventure games with illustrations and music based on science fiction novels, including the works of Ray Bradbury and Arthur C. Clarke (10m45s).
• The job was initially supposed to involve making packaging and running ads, but the product manager discovered that they needed to figure out how to get the development team's attention to create products for the next Christmas (11m15s).
• To achieve this, the product manager started an internal newsletter, using desktop publishing as a beta tester for the Mac, to mention and praise the engineering team members who worked on the project, which led to 40 engineers working on the project within three to four months (11m44s).
• This experience taught the product manager that marketing is the product, and that the product's success is what matters, not just adding a logo to it (12m21s).
• The product manager worked on five products that went gold and saved the company, and learned the importance of being in the room and making decisions, even without knowing how to code (12m36s).
• One of the products, Fahrenheit 451, was a huge success, and the product manager received a call from jazz musician Herbie Hancock, who loved the game and had stayed up all night to play it (13m39s).
• The product manager's experience and approach to product management, including thanking and deflecting credit to the team, demonstrated natural product management skills (14m5s).

What people often get wrong when building products (14m9s)

• When building a product, people often miss or misunderstand that empathy is not about kindness, but rather a necessity, as the product is being made for others, and it's the creator's responsibility to ensure it meets their needs, not the other way around (14m29s).
• A common mistake in project management is running out of time or money, but professionals understand that unexpected things will happen and plan accordingly, without relying on good intentions as a reason for extensions (14m47s).
• For software as a service, building a network effect into the product is crucial, as it relies on users telling others about it, and if the product doesn't work better when shared, it's unlikely to be successful, and marketing efforts will be hindered (15m18s).

Building a brand in the age of AI (16m0s)

• A brand is not a logo, but a promise of what customers can expect from a company, and what they would miss if the company were gone (16m26s).
• To build a brand, a company must stand for something and clearly state what it does and doesn't do (16m51s).
• AI will soon stop being a feature that distinguishes companies, and instead, companies will need to focus on the promise they make to their users and how they keep it (16m59s).
• Making absurd promises may work for venture capitalists, but it doesn't work for consumers, who can only be disappointed once before losing trust (17m30s).
• Airlines are an example of companies that don't have brands or loyalty, as customers only stick with them for rewards points, which is essentially bribery (17m40s).
• True loyalty is when customers would pay extra to stick with a company, and if they wouldn't, then the brand has no value (17m50s).
• The key to building a brand is to make an ambitious promise and actually deliver on it, which is especially important in a world where many companies are making promises that they don't keep (18m10s).
• The AI element raises the bar for companies, as many more promises are being made, but fewer are being kept (18m1s).
• Companies like Claude, an AI company, have successfully built a brand by making promises and keeping them, while also showing kindness and humility when they don't know something (18m16s).
• In contrast, companies like ChatGPT have a reputation for overpromising and underdelivering, which can damage their brand (18m20s).
• Anthropics' billboards for Claude, which emphasized the company's lack of drama, are an example of effective branding (18m53s).

Using AI to enhance writing (19m4s)

• The process of using AI to enhance writing involves uploading content to an AI tool, such as Claude, and asking for suggestions or feedback to improve the writing. (19m8s)
• The AI tool can be used to complete lists, suggest new ideas, and identify claims that may not be sustainable, acting as a patient editor that is hard to find in the real world. (19m33s)
• The AI tool can also be used to refine sentences that don't sound like the writer's voice, helping to identify why the sentence may not be effective. (20m14s)
• Using AI in this way can help writers skip the step of putting out imperfect content and instead create better content from the start. (20m37s)
• Blogging every day can help build a queue of content, taking the pressure off and allowing for more time to rewrite and refine ideas. (20m44s)
• Having a queue of content can shift the mindset from "I have to write something" to "I get to write something," allowing for more freedom and creativity in writing. (21m15s)

Four critical elements for an effective strategy (22m40s)

• The book "This is Strategy" discusses how to build strategy and develop a strategy, with a key section focusing on four critical choices that determine the future of a product or business: choosing customers, competition, source of validation, and distribution (22m51s).
• The first choice is picking customers, as the model of trying to appeal to anyone is unlikely to succeed, and instead, choosing a smallest viable audience allows for a clear understanding of their needs and preferences (23m47s).
• Choosing customers determines everything that goes into the product and its future, and examples such as Humane pin people and a wedding photographer in the Hamptons illustrate the importance of selecting the right customers (24m14s).
• The second choice is who the competition is, as competing against a company like Walmart means being prepared for their pricing strategies and understanding the boundaries of the operating space (25m14s).
• The third choice is the source of validation, as trying to please a boss or a specific group of people can impact the direction of the product or business, and having a clear understanding of who to please can improve decision-making (25m36s).
• The fourth choice is distribution, which matters significantly in the software business, and examples from the video game industry illustrate how distribution channels can impact competitors and the overall business strategy (26m1s).
• When creating a product, it's essential to consider four key factors that are interconnected and cannot be easily changed: the product itself, its distribution, who it's being sold to, and the pricing strategy, as changes in one area can significantly impact the others (26m13s).
• The distribution method can greatly impact the product, as seen in the shift from physical products in ziplock bags and computer stores to downloadable shareware and platforms like Steam (26m16s).
• Understanding the distribution method and target audience is crucial, as it affects the product's development and marketing strategy (26m42s).
• When starting a business, it's vital to define the target audience and distribution channels early on, as this will impact the company's direction and focus (27m7s).
• Picking the right customer is essential, as it will determine the company's relationships and interactions, and entrepreneurs should be prepared to spend time with their chosen audience (27m15s).
• The target audience can significantly impact the business, as seen in the example of a company selling a product to real estate agents, which requires a specific type of relationship and interaction (27m17s).
• Entrepreneurs should be cautious when choosing their target audience, as it can affect their business and personal relationships, and consider whether they are ready to work with that particular group (27m23s).
• Defining the target audience and distribution channels can help entrepreneurs avoid mistakes, such as creating a product that is not well-suited for the chosen market or audience (27m30s).

The role of tension in strategy (27m38s)

• Tension is a crucial element in a great strategy, and it is different from stress, which is generally not good and involves conflicting desires or needs (27m51s).
• Stress is about being torn between two opposing things, such as wanting to leave a job but needing the income, whereas tension is at the heart of every art form and innovation (28m6s).
• Tension is about the possibility that something might not work, creating a sense of uncertainty and anticipation (28m13s).
• When launching a new product, tension is created by presenting a possibility that can change someone's life, making them imagine what their life would be like if that possibility were true (28m29s).
• This tension is fueled by the question of whether the product will deliver on its promise and work for the person (28m37s).
• The example of PF Flyers sneakers illustrates how tension can be created by a promise, in this case, the promise of making the wearer fast enough to run away from a bully (28m45s).
• The failure to deliver on this promise can damage trust and harm a brand, highlighting the importance of honesty and delivering on promises (29m9s).

The concept of the purple cow (29m15s)

• The concept of the Purple Cow emphasizes the importance of being remarkable, which means being worth making a remark about, and it's not just about creating a viral video or gimmick, but rather making something that improves people's lives and encourages them to talk about it (29m38s).
• Steve Blank's idea of customer traction is relevant, where the best way to determine if a startup has potential is if customers stick around, come back for more, and tell their friends about it (29m59s).
• The word "remarkable" means worth making a remark about, and if a product or service is remarkable, people are more likely to talk about it and share it with others (30m20s).
• Marissa Mayer's approach to product management at Google is cited as an example, where she limited the number of buttons on the homepage to two, making a promise to users that they would be taken where they wanted to go without having to browse through many links (30m55s).
• Google's simplicity and effectiveness made it remarkable, and people were more likely to tell their friends about it, which contributed to its success (31m54s).
• Word of mouth is often the most effective way to win in business, rather than relying on paid advertising or sales teams, and being remarkable is key to encouraging word of mouth (32m10s).
• Being remarkable is not just for small companies, as Microsoft's success with Microsoft Word is attributed to its ability to create a format that people needed to work with, making it in their interest to insist on using it (32m33s).
• Creating tension, such as Mercer's approach, can be an effective way to create a remarkable product or service, but it can also be challenging and may create tension both with visitors and internally (33m4s).

Safe is risky (33m11s)

• Systems are everywhere and often invisible, taken for granted, and they protect themselves by inventing culture, which is the way things are around a particular place or group (33m25s).
• When something seems scary, it's likely because the system wants you to think that way, and instead of being fearless, one should think about why it scares them and which system will be offended if they take action (33m51s).
• It's essential to consider whether you're working with the system or if you have enough leverage to help change the system (34m11s).
• The first people who put up downloadable software received feedback that it would be pirated and they wouldn't make a penny, but this was partly because the dominant system of software distribution didn't want them to experiment with this new approach (34m22s).
• Sometimes, taking a risk and trying something new can be beneficial, as seen in the example of downloadable software, where the potential loss was limited to the five months spent working on the software (34m37s).
• The opposite example is Salesforce, which initially promoted the idea of "no software" and everything being in the cloud, but once this became the norm, it became the new system and the risky move (34m48s).

The power of systems (34m56s)

• To be a strategic thinker, it means to see the system, which is core to being better and understanding how to make improvements. (34m58s)
• Systems are essential for interoperability, and we invent them whenever we engage with other human beings, such as the system for greeting people in our culture. (35m17s)
• Systems serve a valuable function until they become self-reinforcing and start doing things to support themselves, rather than their original purpose. (35m42s)
• An example of a toxic system is the job interview process, where the most successful interviews are often those who are similar to the interviewer, which diminishes diversity and the ability to put real talent on the team. (35m54s)
• If we don't see and name these systems, we will continue to reinforce them, as seen in the example of a company that hired four people who were all captains of their Ivy League tennis teams. (36m28s)
• While some systems, like the metric system and the ZIP code system, continue to work well, others may need to be changed or challenged in order to succeed, especially when dominant players don't want you to succeed. (36m50s)

Better waves make better surfers (37m7s)

• The concept "better waves make better surfers" suggests that success is often driven by choosing the right opportunities rather than solely relying on one's skills (37m7s).
• Great surfers are often on good waves, and they tend to pass up waves that others might take, waiting for the right one to come along (37m26s).
• This concept can be applied to business and life, where choosing the right company, people, or opportunities can lead to greater success (37m40s).
• It's essential to be willing to wait for the right opportunity, such as a superstar who can make a significant impact, rather than rushing to meet a deadline and settling for mediocre work (37m50s).
• Mediocre work is average, and to achieve something different, one must do something different from what others are doing (37m59s).
• If one doesn't strive to be different, they will likely end up with average results, similar to what others are achieving (38m6s).

Rebranding vs. re-logoing (38m10s)

• Jaguar's recent rebranding effort is considered a re-logoing rather than a rebranding, as the company is trying to make a different promise by switching to all-electric cars, but the new logo undermines many of the awareness assets they already had (38m26s).
• If a company is going to start from scratch, it will need to spend a significant amount of money to earn trust from people who have never heard of them, but Jaguar already has an iconic and beloved brand, so it's a mistake to walk away from that (38m51s).
• The goal of rebranding should be to own the existing brand's assets and build on them, rather than trying to please an art director with a new logo (39m8s).
• Creating buzz through controversy or a new logo does not necessarily lead to sales, as seen in the example of the International House of Pancakes' false announcement of a name change to the International House of Burgers (39m41s).
• What will make Jaguar sell cars is customer traction, which can be achieved by finding 50 people with authority and getting them to experience the car in a way that transforms them (40m12s).
• Tesla's success with the Model S can be attributed to its ability to create a conversation and provide a unique experience, such as the door handles and the "ludicrous mode" (40m29s).
• The Cybertruck, on the other hand, is considered a divisive product that may not be successful, as it is intentionally divisive and does not provide utility to help people get what they want (41m17s).
• The pickup truck category is a significant market, and a company like Tesla could have crossed the chasm by creating a product that meets the needs of customers in this category, but instead, they decided to create a stunt with the Cybertruck (41m42s).
• The Ford F-150 is a successful product in the pickup truck category, and it has earned the trust of a lot of people, but the Cybertruck may not be able to replicate this success due to its divisive design (42m3s).

Empathetic leadership (43m7s)

• The secrets of leadership can be simplified to doing what you believe, painting a picture of the future, and going there, as people will follow, reminiscent of Elon Musk's approach (43m15s).
• However, painting a picture of the future needs to be based on empathy, understanding where others want to go, rather than just where you want to go (43m31s).
• This approach requires non-narcissism, recognizing that you're not entitled to success, but rather can be of service to help people achieve their goals (43m46s).
• Instead of feeling entitled to success, professionals can open the door to help people get to where they've always wanted to go, which is often more effective than trying to change what people want (44m0s).
• Offering people a chance to achieve their long-held desires can be a powerful way to lead and make a positive impact (44m10s).

Conclusion and farewell (44m14s)

• The conversation concludes with appreciation expressed for the opportunity to discuss the topic, and gratitude is extended to the audience for listening (44m15s).
• To learn more about Seth's work, people can visit his blog at seth.blog, where they can find information about his book, strategy deck, and other projects (44m26s).
• Seth is not active on social media, but his blog serves as a central hub for updates and information about his work (44m26s).
• The conversation ends with a thank you message from Seth, who enjoyed the discussion and appreciated the questions (44m44s).
• The host, Lenny, thanks Seth for being on the show and invites listeners to subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or their favorite podcast app (44m51s).
• Listeners are also encouraged to give the podcast a rating or leave a review to help others find the show (45m0s).
• More information about the podcast, including past episodes, can be found at Lenny podcast.com (45m7s).