If Netflix can't make live work, can anyone? | The Vergecast

Introduction and Candy Talk

• The host, David Pierce, shares his experience of buying candy on a TikTok live stream, including freeze-dried Skittles and Swedish candy called "bubs," and expresses confusion about how the candy companies and people are getting their products and repackaging them for resale (52s).
• David Pierce mentions that he bought candy on a TikTok live stream while walking his dog and is expecting a delivery of the candy in 2 to 4 days, but is unsure if he ordered from an actual company (1m1s).
• The topic of the episode is not about candy, but rather about the Jake Paul and Mike Tyson fight on Netflix and what it means for the sports streaming world, particularly since Netflix had a massively popular event that didn't go great (1m47s).
• The episode will also discuss the sports streaming world and whether anyone can succeed in it if Netflix can't, as well as an interview with Roland Allen, who wrote a book about the history of notebooks and their importance in history and in the digital age (2m5s).
• A hotline question about the TikTok shop will also be discussed, which sent the producer down a wild rabbit hole (2m31s).
• The episode is sponsored by Polestar, an electric performance car brand focused on innovation and design (2m49s).

Jake Paul vs. Mike Tyson and Sports Streaming

• The host mentions that the Jake Paul and Mike Tyson fight was both the fight of the year and not, and that he doesn't particularly care about boxing, but is interested in what the event means for Netflix and the sports streaming world (3m29s).
• A recent boxing match between Jake Paul and Mike Tyson was discussed, with the fight being described as a mismatch between a YouTuber and a man in his late 50s (3m48s).
• The more interesting story is how Netflix handled the live streaming of the event, which is seen as a test for the company's ability to take over live TV and for the streaming industry as a whole (4m2s).
• Richard Lawler was invited to discuss the topic, and he mentioned that he did not watch the fight, considering it a poor choice of event (4m44s).
• Lawler joked that if he wanted to see a YouTuber fight an old man, he could just go outside and film it himself, highlighting the absurdity of the event (5m7s).
• The discussion turned to the question of whether streaming is ready for sports, with Amazon making progress with football, but Netflix's handling of the fight raising concerns (5m30s).
• Despite having the data and knowing the interest in the fight, Netflix was not ready for the event, which was surprising given their resources and experience (5m56s).
• The technical challenges of delivering live events were discussed, with the difficulty of providing high-quality streams with minimal delay being a major issue (6m17s).
• The problem of delivering live events is considered potentially unsolvable, with the inability to pre-load content and the need for real-time streaming making it a unique challenge (6m58s).
• Streaming issues with big event shows like Game of Thrones have largely been resolved, but live streaming remains a challenge due to the physical infrastructure required to make it happen over the internet (7m37s).
• The main issue is that the internet was not designed to handle live streaming, and companies are having to create workarounds to solve the problem (7m57s).
• One potential solution, L4S, was supposed to help with latency issues, but it has not yet been widely adopted (8m7s).
• Companies are using various strategies to ensure smooth live streaming, but the complexity of the process, including different devices, bit rates, encodings, and DRM protection, makes it difficult to solve the problem (8m19s).
• Netflix's recent live streaming event was criticized for its poor quality, but it's possible that the company did the best it could with the current technology (8m52s).
• The fact that some people were able to watch a live stream of the event on TikTok, which was not delayed like the Netflix stream, suggests that live streaming can work, but there may be a "magic number" of viewers at which point the system becomes overwhelmed (9m44s).
• Netflix's upcoming live streaming of Christmas football games will provide an interesting test case for the limits of live streaming infrastructure (10m3s).
• Netflix's live streaming capabilities will be put to the test with its upcoming football games and the halftime show featuring Beyoncé, and it's unlikely that the company can completely fix its internet issues between now and Christmas to ensure a smooth streaming experience for all users (10m34s).
• The challenges of live streaming are complex, involving multiple people, places, and issues, such as network problems, backend node connections, and varying demand in different locations, which can lead to dissatisfaction among viewers, even if the streaming is good in most places but not in a specific city like Baltimore (10m55s).
• Beyoncé's halftime show at one of the games is a significant event that demonstrates Netflix's seriousness about live streaming, and her performance is expected to attract millions of viewers who will not want to miss it, especially since it will be her first time performing songs from her new album (11m38s).
• Netflix's decision to venture into live sports, including the Beyoncé halftime show, marks a significant shift in the company's strategy, as it had previously been content with creating ancillary content around games and not competing in live sports (12m43s).
• The move into live sports may be part of Netflix's effort to keep subscribers engaged and prevent cancellations, by offering huge events every few months, such as the Beyoncé halftime show, which can encourage viewers to keep their subscriptions active (13m9s).
• This strategy is similar to the playbook used by HBO and Showtime in the past, where they would announce big events, such as boxing matches or music performances, to keep subscribers interested and prevent cancellations (13m35s).
• Netflix is expected to announce a live event, possibly related to Stranger Things, on the day after Christmas, which could attract a large audience and create a spectacle (13m46s).
• Despite having enough money to invest in live sports, Netflix's efforts in this area have been inconsistent, with some events, like the hot dog competition, not attracting much attention, while others, like the reality show, experiencing technical issues (14m31s).
• The company is likely to continue experimenting with different formats, including sports and comedy, to find a successful formula (14m47s).
• Amazon has been broadcasting Thursday night football for a couple of years, but its approach has been traditional, with Al Michaels providing commentary, and not particularly innovative (15m3s).
• Peacock is now streaming Sunday Night Football, but it's essentially just taking the TV broadcast and making it available online, without adding much new or interactive content (15m31s).
• YouTube's Sunday Ticket is another example of a traditional sports broadcast being made available online, without significant changes or innovations (15m48s).
• There's a debate about whether streaming services should focus on creating new, interactive, and innovative experiences, or simply ensure that their existing offerings work well and are reliable (15m58s).
• What people seem to want is not personalized streams, but rather the ability to watch the same event at the same time as others, creating a sense of community and spectacle (16m25s).
• This can be achieved without the need for advanced technologies like avatars, 3D, or virtual auditoriums, but rather by creating events that people want to watch and share with others (16m37s).
• Netflix's live streaming strategy may not be working as intended, with 60 million people voting against it, suggesting the company may not know what people want, or it could be a deliberate attempt to increase views (16m55s).
• As a streaming sports fan, the current experience is chaotic and expensive, with multiple services and packages required to watch different sports and teams (17m23s).
• The NFL, NBA, NHL, college basketball, and college football seasons are currently underway, making it a great time for sports fans, but the experience is marred by difficulties in accessing games due to various streaming services and packages (17m29s).
• A personal experience of trying to watch the Bills-Chiefs game on Sunday night was unsuccessful, despite having multiple services, highlighting the complexity of the current streaming landscape (17m47s).
• The issue is not limited to mainstream sports, as fans of esoteric sports also face difficulties in accessing games due to limited streaming options (17m58s).
• The local monopoly controlling Pistons streaming has improved, but the overall experience remains frustrating, with multiple packages and subscriptions required to watch different games (18m14s).
• The current streaming setup is not an improvement over traditional cable, with issues such as glitches, repeated ads, and difficulties in accessing games (18m48s).
• In the past, there was a clear mental rubric for finding games on different channels, but the current streaming landscape has made it more complicated (19m3s).
• A personal experience of trying to watch a game on Sling, YouTube TV, and Paramount+ highlights the complexity of navigating different streaming services to access a single game (19m21s).
• The user experienced issues with watching live sports, including a hold on a game that wouldn't let them watch the last 5 minutes, and expressed frustration with the complexity of figuring out which channels to watch. (19m59s)
• The user is unsure if the proposed combination of different companies' rights, known as Venue Sports, will improve the situation, as it depends on the outcome of court cases and the quality of the service if it launches. (20m18s)
• Amazon is expected to have a significant impact on live sports streaming in 2025, with a large number of NBA games and ownership of a share of FanDuel Sports networks, which have local broadcast rights. (20m36s)
• This could potentially allow users to watch most games using a single app, but issues with national TV broadcasts and the need to pay for additional services like ESPN's streaming services may still arise. (20m55s)
• The user notes that the main issue with live sports streaming is no longer old rights deals, but rather the platforms' inability to launch and figure out pricing and serving content to a large audience. (21m44s)
• The NBA's rights deal is expected to be the last to turn over, starting next year, and will likely lead to a big shift in streaming, with Amazon and ESPN playing major roles. (21m46s)
• Despite the potential for exclusive streaming of major events like the Super Bowl, platforms like Netflix are not yet ready to handle such large-scale streaming, and the issue is largely a matter of money. (22m10s)
• The leagues are taking advantage of the situation by playing networks and platforms off each other to get the highest bids and make the most money, leading to a likely 10-year period of switching and swapping between apps. (22m43s)

Peacock's Olympics Success

• Peacock's coverage of the Olympics was a successful example of sports streaming, offering a user-friendly experience with features like the Gold Zone and Prime Time (24m35s).
• Peacock's streaming quality was consistent and high, and the platform made concessions to improve the viewing experience, such as minimizing ad repetition (25m24s).
• The success of Peacock's Olympics coverage gives hope for the future of sports streaming, with the platform setting a high standard for others to follow (25m48s).

Polestar Sponsorship

• The Pulstar 3 car has a minimalist interior, can go from 0 to 60 in 4.8 seconds, and has an EPA estimated range of up to 315 miles per charge, with the option to optimize the powertrain between performance or range mode (26m32s).
• The car features a clutter-free dashboard, 3D surround sound by Bowers and Wilkins, and integration with Google to turn on favorite podcasts (26m50s).

Roland Allen's "The Notebook"

• A book titled "The Notebook: A History of Thinking on Paper" by Roland Allen explores the critical invention of paper and its impact on modern capitalism and history (27m22s).
• The book covers a thousand years of history, from the Renaissance to the present day, and discusses how paper has defined the way people write and record information (27m28s).
• The author argues that without paper, modern capitalism and our understanding of history would be vastly different (27m44s).
• Notebooks have continued to evolve and survive in the digital age, with the author discussing their importance and the systems surrounding note-taking (28m10s).
• Roland Allen was invited to discuss his book and the big ideas surrounding paper and notebooks, including their continued relevance in a digital world (28m18s).
• The conversation covers the history of writing and recording information, from stone and clay tablets to papyrus and wax tablets (28m55s).
• The author highlights the limitations of these early writing materials, including their lack of permanence and portability (29m9s).
• Papyrus, in particular, is noted for its fragility and inability to withstand damp or handling (29m25s).
• Wax tablets, while useful for temporary notes, are not permanent and eventually died out in Europe (29m47s).
• Parchment, a writing material used during the Roman Empire, was tough and indestructible, but the ink used on it could be scraped off, making it not suitable for permanent records (30m29s).
• Paper was introduced in Europe around 1240-1250 and quickly became popular for business and legal purposes because the ink used on it was permanent (31m1s).
• The use of paper led to its rapid adoption in the business community, particularly for contracts, business records, and deeds (31m26s).
• Notebooks were initially used by businesses and governments, but later became popular for personal use, similar to how computers were initially used by businesses and governments before becoming popular for personal use (31m55s).
• The use of notebooks in business led to their widespread adoption, particularly in Italy, which was the richest part of Europe at the time and the birthplace of banking, companies, and accountancy (32m41s).
• The invention of double-entry bookkeeping, limited liability partnerships, and futures markets in Italy was facilitated by the use of notebooks and permanent writing technology (32m56s).
• The use of notebooks for business purposes led to their use for personal and creative purposes, such as writing literature, art, and poetry (33m29s).
• The city of Florence, Italy, is mentioned as a significant location for the development of notebooks and creative writing (33m48s).
• Zaloni is a type of notebook that originated in Florence around 1300, and its name is also associated with a type of salad and a croissant-like pastry (33m55s).
• During this time, before the advent of print, people in Florence would write down poems, stories, recipes, and medicinal cures in their personal notebooks, known as zaloni, which were essentially unsorted collections of various information (34m28s).
• The contents of these notebooks provide valuable insights into the lives and interests of the people of Florence, including their favorite poets, prayers, stories, and remedies (35m22s).
• The notebooks were often passed down through generations, with some being mentioned in wills, and they were valued by their owners, who would sometimes leave dedications or engage in written arguments with family members within the pages (36m33s).
• The primary purpose of keeping a zaloni was for personal enjoyment, rather than for historical or academic purposes, and they were not intended to be formal or organized records (36m24s).
• Over time, people in Florence began to view their families as businesses and started keeping records of their family history and activities in what they called a "liber familia" or "Ricordanza" (37m14s).
• The zaloni notebooks were unique to Florence and were a local phenomenon, but they offer a fascinating glimpse into the daily lives and concerns of people living in the city during the 14th century (35m45s).
• Historical family records, known as family books or family records, were kept to document important events such as births, deaths, marriages, and investments, and were passed down through generations in a formal and business-like manner (37m21s).
• In the 1500s and 1600s, European grammar school students were expected to keep a commonplace book as a formal educational exercise, which was a rigorous and effortful task (37m56s).
• Outside of school, people like Leonardo da Vinci kept personal notebooks for various purposes, including drawing, doodling, writing intimate and formal entries, and recording their relationship with God (38m16s).
• There were no hard and fast rules for keeping notebooks, and people found new ways to fill them up over time, with everyone developing their unique approach (38m35s).
• Leonardo da Vinci's notebooks are considered history's most famous notebooks, and they provide an amazing record of his thoughts, research, and personality (38m59s).
• Da Vinci did not intend for his notebooks to be publicly consumed, and they were only recognized as significant much later, with the German researcher Richa playing a crucial role in transcribing and publishing them in the 1890s (39m29s).
• The publication of Leonardo's notebooks led to a shift in how people perceived the importance of notebooks, with artists like Picasso starting to take their notebooks more seriously and recognizing the value of the creative process (40m46s).
• The relationship between artists and their sketchbooks has changed over time, with artists like Picasso keeping their sketchbooks seriously and having them cataloged and numbered, whereas 100 years prior, artists had a more casual relationship with their notebooks and didn't think anyone else would find them interesting (41m4s).
• This change is partly due to the influence of Leonardo, who, 400 years after his death, inadvertently prompted a shift in how people view notebooks, with many well-known writers now selling their papers to universities for a significant amount of money (41m37s).
• The fact that universities now collect and pay for writers' notebooks has changed the way people look at these notebooks, making them more self-conscious about what they write, and potentially altering the content to be more suitable for public consumption (42m3s).
• Notebooks are often seen as intensely private things, but once the writer becomes aware that someone else might see them, the content may change, becoming more curated and less authentic (42m38s).
• Diary writing, in particular, can be affected by the knowledge that someone else might read it, with some published diaries being written with publication in mind, while others, like the writer's own diary, are kept private and uncensored (42m45s).
• The use of computers and digital tools has not replaced the need for notebooks, with many people still using them for the same purposes as they were used 800 years ago (43m44s).
• The invention of paper was a crucial factor in the development of notebooks, and it's possible that if computers had been invented in 1200 instead of paper, the course of history might have been different (43m55s).
• While we live in a digital world, it's also possible to argue that we live in a "notebook world," as capitalism, which has driven many technological advancements, was initially based on a notebook-based system of ledgers and account books (44m39s).
• The invention of the notebook in Italy around 1300 is mentioned alongside the development of mechanisms of capitalism, highlighting the significant impact of inventions on the world. (45m6s)
• The concept of an invention shaping the world in unexpected ways is discussed, using Twitter as an example of something that became ubiquitous and then declined. (45m29s)
• The bullet Journal phenomenon is compared to the invention of the notebook, with a "straight line" drawn between the two, highlighting the persistence of the idea of recording lives in physical notebooks over centuries. (45m52s)
• The simplicity of the notebook is cited as a key factor in its enduring popularity, with its minimalism making it a "perfect" technology that cannot be improved upon. (46m48s)
• The bullet Journal is seen as an example of how a simple technology can be reinvented and used in new ways, opening up possibilities for people and improving their lives. (47m7s)
• The use of bullet points to organize life is mentioned as a way to help people make decisions and live happier lives, with a surprising number of people benefiting from this practice. (47m20s)
• The simplicity and lack of requirements for batteries or system updates are given as reasons for the notebook's enduring appeal. (47m43s)
• The bullet Journal's history and trend are discussed as a significant factor in building confidence in the idea that people are interested in this topic. (48m9s)
• The creator of the bullet Journal, Ryder Carroll, is mentioned as someone who has thought deeply about the implications of writing things down. (48m30s)
• Ryder Carroll's approach to notebooking was found to be interesting due to his serious and thoughtful consideration of the topic, which led to him being given a chapter in a book about notebooking (48m57s).
• Carroll's inspiration for notebooking came from artists' scrapbooks, collages, and sketchbooks that contained elements of diaries, which is a unique expression of one's experience (49m18s).
• The way of thinking about notebooking and journaling lagged behind the business side of things, which became systematized and specific, with accepted rules on how to keep notebooks (49m48s).
• Despite the systematization of business notebooking, people's personal notebooking and journaling practices did not follow a similar pattern, with Ryder Carroll's approach being a notable exception (50m12s).
• The reason for this lag is unknown, and it is also unclear why people started writing diaries in England around 1570, which is a question that has been researched but remains unanswered (50m41s).
• A theory is proposed that the increasing use of digital tools has led to informational chaos, resulting in people craving systems to manage their lives (51m29s).
• This craving for systems is seen as a response to the overwhelming amount of information and events that people are exposed to in their personal and professional lives (51m44s).
• The question of how to manage this informational chaos and the desire for systems is still being reckoned with, and it is unclear what the solution will be (52m1s).
• The idea of creating a sense of control and structure in a chaotic world is appealing to people, as seen in the popularity of bullet journaling, which allows individuals to create a personalized and organized space that reflects their identity (52m48s).
• The act of creating a notebook or journal can be therapeutic and provide a sense of calm, as it allows individuals to process and organize their thoughts and emotions (53m15s).
• The need for structure and control is more pressing now than ever, given the overwhelming amount of information and stimuli people are exposed to in their daily lives (53m37s).
• One way to cope with the constant influx of information is to write a diary, which can help to process and manage the "ephemeral non-stop flow of craziness" and turn it into a calm and controlled entity (54m29s).
• The act of writing in a diary can be likened to taking a shower, as it provides a sense of refreshment and cleansing, and can help to clear one's mind (54m56s).
• Despite the widespread use of digital tools, many people still prefer to use notebooks and journals for personal reflection and organization, suggesting that there is something unique and valuable about the physical act of writing (55m39s).
• The challenge of replicating the satisfaction and value of physical notebooks in digital note-taking apps remains, despite the many options available (55m51s).
• The use of physical notebooks and pens has not been fully replaced by digital alternatives, and many people still prefer them for note-taking and writing. (55m54s)
• Research using MRI scans and voxel-based morphometry has shown that writing in a notebook engages different parts of the brain than typing or writing on a digital device, including the hippocampus, which is responsible for mental mapping and spatial memory. (56m27s)
• The hippocampus is used when writing in a notebook because the physical space of the notebook provides a geography that helps with memory and recall, allowing users to remember the location of specific notes and ideas within the notebook. (56m38s)
• In contrast, digital notes do not have a physical geography and can be easily scrolled through, making it harder for the brain to create spatial memories and recall specific information. (57m42s)
• The sensory experience of writing with a pen and paper is also richer and more engaging than typing, requiring more effort and processing of ideas, which can lead to a deeper understanding of the material being written about. (58m26s)
• This is why many teachers and academics prefer students to take notes by hand rather than typing them, as it requires more active engagement with the material and can lead to better retention and understanding. (59m10s)
• Moleskine has been building digital tools, including a calendar app and journaling system, but they have not gained the same level of attention as their physical notebooks (59m22s).
• There have been attempts to create smart pens and digital writing systems that can transcribe handwritten notes, but they have not yet achieved the same level of appeal as traditional notebooks (59m46s).
• The idea of a notebook that combines the benefits of physical and digital writing is desirable, but it has yet to be successfully achieved (1h0m4s).
• Some people have found success with products like Moleskine's Magic Paper and the reMarkable tablet, but they have not become widely popular (1h0m36s).

Moleskine's Design and Minimalism

• Moleskine's success can be attributed to the design and minimalism of their notebooks, which were conceived by Maria Sebregondi (1h1m24s).
• Sebregondi added features such as an elastic strap, pocket, and page for contact information to the basic notebook design, making it seem more minimal and desirable (1h1m30s).
• Moleskine's focus on minimalism and simplicity has contributed to their success, with a profit margin of 43% and a reputation for creating high-quality products (1h2m35s).
• Despite some questionable collaborations, Moleskine's core product remains highly regarded, and their success is a testament to the power of good design (1h2m57s).
• The idea of customizing products, such as notebooks, is compared to the concept of freedom, where people often prefer a blank slate to create their own content rather than a pre-designed one (1h3m5s).

Polestar Ad Break

• The discussion takes a break, and the support for the podcast is acknowledged, coming from Pstar, an electric vehicle manufacturer (1h3m58s).
• Pstar's first all-electric SUV, the Pstar 3, features a computer-controlled torque vectoring system, allowing for tighter turns and optimized powertrain performance (1h4m2s).
• The Pstar 3 has a sleek aerodynamic exterior and a minimalist interior, with an intuitive infotainment screen and an uncluttered dashboard (1h4m31s).

Hotline: CarPlay Adaptable Screens

• The podcast returns from the break, and the hotline is introduced, where listeners can send in their questions, with a specific question about carplay adaptable screens being discussed (1h5m1s).
• A listener, Sean from Ohio, asks about carplay adaptable screens that can be retrofitted into old vehicles, allowing them to use carplay or Android auto, and wonders if they are good or just a gimmick (1h5m37s).
• The producer, Will, investigates the question and searches for carplay screens on Tik Tok, finding exactly what the listener described (1h6m31s).
• A listener, Sean, was looking into a portable Apple CarPlay device to make his older car feel more expensive, and a product was found on TikTok for $37, allegedly marked down from $1120, which seemed suspicious due to similar listings with similar prices and markdowns (1h6m39s).
• The product, a 7-inch color touchscreen, comes with a couple of different mounting options, a backup camera, and other features, and was ordered to test its legitimacy (1h7m1s).
• The product arrived quickly, with the brand name "uni" on the box, and included a power cable, aux cable, backup camera, and mounting options (1h8m5s).
• Initial impressions of the device were that the 7-inch screen was large and had an iPad Mini vibe, but the mounts were made of cheap plastic, raising concerns about stability (1h8m19s).
• The device was installed in a Prius, which already had a screen, and mounting it required finding a spot that wouldn't block the view of the road or speedometer (1h9m1s).
• The suction and adhesive mounts worked well, and the screen turned on and functioned properly, with options for CarPlay, Android Auto, and audio output (1h9m30s).
• Setup was easy, and the screen was reasonably bright and responsive, although a bit laggy and washed out, but still a significant improvement over the existing Prius screen (1h9m48s).
• The device was tested while driving, and it performed well, with Google Maps being particularly useful on the larger screen, and texts being easy to see (1h10m10s).
• Audio setup was more complicated, with options including a standard aux jack, Bluetooth, and sending audio to FM radio, which was a preferred option (1h10m29s).
• A device with an internal speaker was tested, which is not ideal but sufficient for directions, and it has an FM radio feature that plays music and podcasts, including The Vergecast, with a throwback feel (1h10m50s).
• The device was tested in a car, and while it worked, there were issues with installation, requiring cable management to connect the power, audio, and backup camera, which can be a hassle (1h11m31s).
• The device's screen is cheap but functional, and it provides CarPlay in cars that don't have it, but it may not be worth the risk of theft, especially in neighborhoods with high car break-in rates (1h11m26s).
• The device's value is questionable, as it may not be better than simply putting a phone in a holster on the dashboard, but this may vary depending on individual preferences (1h13m11s).

Outro and Credits

• The Vergecast podcast discussed various topics, including Jake Paul, Mike Tyson, Netflix, Roland Allen's book, and the TikTok shop, with links to more information available on the verge.com website (1h13m35s).
• The podcast is produced by Liam James, Will P, and Eric Gomez, and is part of the VOX media podcast network, with new episodes and topics coming up in the future (1h14m7s).

Final Polestar Ad

• The P star 3 is an all-electric SUV that is now available on the roads across the US, boasting a sleek aerodynamic exterior and a spacious minimalist interior (1h14m33s).
• The vehicle features a custom-developed Android automotive OS that is fully integrated to enhance the driving experience (1h14m46s).
• The P star 3's infotainment system includes an intuitive screen, smart voice controls, and over-the-air updates (1h14m53s).
• The vehicle is equipped with 3D surround sound by Bowers and Wilkins, allowing for an immersive listening experience (1h15m1s).
• Interested individuals can test drive the P star 3 at their local P star space and book a test drive on the P star website at pollstar.com (1h15m8s).