The Vergecast Vergecast, part two | The Vergecast

Intro (0s)

• The Vergecast is the flagship podcast of The Verge, and the host, David Pierce, is outside for the first time in a while after being sick and spending most of his time on the couch watching shows he's seen before (0s).
• David Pierce is doing the intro while on a walk outside, which is something he always does, and has done in various locations in the past, such as on a train, in a paint shop, and while putting together Legos (26s).
• Some listeners have questioned the purpose of the intro, suggesting that it's unnecessary and that the show should just focus on tech news, but David Pierce plans to continue doing the intro (59s).
• The show will be answering questions from listeners about The Verge, The Vergecast, ads, and the media industry, and will feature discussions with Helen Havac, the publisher, and Nilay Patel, the co-host (1m11s).
• The topics of discussion will include the business and editorial sides of The Verge, how they think about what they make and who they make it for, and how they charge for it (1m30s).
• The conversation may get wonky and detailed at times, but David Pierce believes it's an important story about the internet and the challenges of making it work (1m42s).
• The Verge is not the only one navigating these challenges, and David Pierce hopes that sharing their experiences and thoughts will be interesting and informative (1m59s).
• The show will be split into two chunks, with the first part featuring a conversation with Helen Havac about the business side of things (2m37s).

Business Insights (2m44s)

• The Verge and The Vergecast are kept as separate as possible, with Helen discussing financial aspects and Nei discussing broader topics such as show production and The Verge's overall strategy (2m45s).
• Helen is the publisher of The Verge, acting as a buffer between the newsroom and the business side, and is responsible for overseeing the newsroom and ensuring The Verge makes enough money to support its journalism (4m31s).
• As the publisher, Helen's role is to be the "firewall" between the business and editorial sides, ensuring the independence of The Verge's journalism while keeping the company financially sustainable (4m55s).
• Helen's job involves managing the company, working on strategy, and communicating with Nei, with her most important task being to maintain the separation between the business and editorial sides (5m23s).
• Helen's responsibilities are divided into three main areas: management headaches (30%), maintaining existing businesses such as advertising (30%), and developing new businesses such as subscriptions (30%) (5m40s).
• Helen's role requires her to be both high-level and detail-oriented, working on both big-picture strategy and day-to-day management tasks (5m35s).
• One of the key topics Helen will discuss is subscriptions, which has been a major focus for The Verge this year (6m7s).

Subscription Mode (6m16s)

• The Verge has been considering a subscription model due to pressures on media businesses, including the dominance of companies like Facebook and Google in digital advertising, and changes in distribution. (6m18s)
• The Verge has its own adtech stack called Concert, which has helped insulate the company from some of these pressures, but a subscription model is seen as a way to further protect the business. (7m13s)
• The rise of generative search is changing the way people consume content, and The Verge is preparing for a future where it may not receive as much traffic from other platforms. (7m50s)
• A subscription model is seen as a way to build a loyal audience and insulate the business from changes in the industry, with the goal of creating a healthy subscriptions business. (9m2s)
• The decision to launch a subscription model now is seen as a necessary step, with the idea that the best time to launch such a business is 10 years ago, but the next best time is tomorrow. (9m17s)
• The ultimate goal is to have a diverse business model that includes advertising, subscriptions, and a large and dedicated audience, rather than betting on just one of these options. (9m23s)
• This approach is seen as a way to avoid the pitfalls of other media companies that have focused too heavily on one revenue stream, and to create a more sustainable business model. (9m51s)
• Businesses used to focus on total traffic and page views, but it has become clear that true audience engagement is different from page views, and true audience is the key to a successful business model (9m55s).
• The true audience of a media brand, such as The Verge, is made up of people who come to the site directly, form habits around the brand, and care about the content, and this audience is the single biggest asset for the brand (10m20s).
• A direct, loyal audience can support various business models, including advertising, subscription-based, and commerce businesses, and is essential for a media brand's survival in the next 13 years (10m52s).
• A subscription-based model aligns the media brand's interests with those of its audience, as it creates a direct relationship between the brand and its readers, who become clients that the brand is accountable to (11m45s).
• Nick Thompson, former boss at Wired, noted that a paywall system aligns the media brand's interests with those of its readers, creating a sense of direction and purpose (11m17s).
• A subscription-based model can deepen the relationship between the media brand and its audience, making the brand more accountable to its readers and aligning editorial and business incentives (12m2s).
• Advertising can reward good journalism, but a subscription-based model provides a more direct and loyal relationship with the audience (12m31s).
• The Verge's audience has been asking questions about the subscription model, with the most asked question being about ad-free podcasts, including The Vergecast (12m48s).

Ad-Free Podcasts (13m10s)

• The current state of the media industry is described as a "blood bath" with competitors cutting jobs, newsrooms moving away from reporting, and journalism jobs disappearing, making it challenging for The Verge to continue existing (13m29s).
• The success of The Verge and its subscription product is not about making media executives rich, but rather about being able to continue existing and potentially hiring more journalists in the future (13m41s).
• The media business is not a highly profitable industry, and The Verge's goal is to sustain itself and create better content, rather than generating significant profits (14m3s).
• The reason PR people outnumber journalists 6 to 1 in the country is that journalists can often make more money in other industries, and The Verge has lost reporters to companies like Google (14m32s).
• The Verge's subscription product includes a premium ad experience, rather than an ad-free experience, because the company still relies heavily on advertising revenue and needs to take care of its ad business (15m7s).
• The premium ad experience was chosen because it addresses users' concerns about having fewer ads, better ads, and no "chum boxes" that interrupt their reading experience (15m39s).
• By removing third-party ad units, The Verge can sell ads directly to advertisers and keep all the revenue, rather than giving a cut to third parties (16m10s).
• VOX Media, the company behind The Verge, makes its own adtech, which is a unique aspect of the business (16m33s).
• The premium ad experience on the website allows for serving own ads without giving anyone else a cut, potentially providing a powerful tool to do better in the ads business and streamlining the page for a better audience experience (16m36s).
• The website's ad business may benefit from the premium ad experience, making more people read and have a better experience, which can lead to reading more pages (16m47s).
• The podcast was not included at launch due to technical and business barriers, with the best time to launch a subscription being 10 years ago (17m3s).
• Technical barriers to podcast advertising include not controlling the platforms where people listen to podcasts, making it hard to have an ad-free podcast feed (17m25s).
• Most people create a separate ad-free feed for subscribers, which can reduce total numbers and take engaged audience out of the main feed (17m51s).
• Apple Podcasts subscriptions are available, but they own the customer relationships and credit cards, which is not good for business (18m21s).
• The business issue is a bigger problem, as podcast ads are currently worth more than website ads and are a more engaging ad format (19m29s).
• The Verge wanted to keep the subscription price point low to be accessible to as many people as possible, but podcast ads being more expensive makes it challenging (19m7s).
• Advertisers love The Vergecast, and podcast advertising is outperforming other forms of advertising, making it very expensive (19m53s).
• The Vergecast is grateful for its engaged listeners, but taking ads out of the podcast for them would be costly, exceeding the revenue generated from subscriptions (20m1s).
• Two possible solutions are being explored: an ad-light experience with fewer ads, or a separate tier of Verge subscription that would allow for ad-free podcasts without harming the business (20m15s).
• The goal is to continue producing the Vergecast while hiring more journalists, but the business realities of podcasting ads make it challenging to remove ads entirely (21m15s).
• Listeners' feedback on ads and chapters in the podcast is appreciated, and their concerns are being considered (21m27s).
• Regarding Apple News, The Verge now charges for its content, giving less away for free on other platforms, and the best way to support The Verge is to subscribe and use its website (22m17s).
• The Verge is participating in Apple News Plus, and readers will need to be subscribers to access its content on the platform (22m39s).
• Some loyal readers were sad to see The Verge leave Apple News, but it was surprising to see how many people noticed and were loyal to The Verge specifically within Apple News (22m51s).
• The Verge is now charging for content on its website, and to support the platform, users can either subscribe to The Verge or to Apple News Plus, which also features Verge content, providing a win-win situation (23m52s).
• Supporting The Verge through subscription is the best way to help the platform, as it allows users to access premium content while also contributing to the website's revenue (24m15s).
• Adding a subscription model to an ad-supported platform can change how ads are sold, the value of ads, and the demographics of free users, ultimately reducing the value of ads (24m37s).
• The Verge has implemented a premium ad experience instead of an ad-free model to maintain a strong advertising business, as advertisers want to reach the platform's super fans who are willing to pay for the content (24m58s).
• The decision to maintain ads is also driven by the need for advertising revenue to pay the bills, as the advertising business can coexist with the subscription model (25m45s).
• The balance between ads and subscription revenue is crucial, as too many ads can alienate users, while not charging enough for subscriptions can lead to revenue shortfalls, as seen in the case of Netflix (26m0s).
• The Verge aims to strike a balance between providing a good user experience and generating revenue through its premium ad experience and subscription model (26m31s).
• The Verge's subscription price is set at $7 a month or $50 a year, which was determined by considering affordability and the desire to reach people who have a personal relationship with the platform (26m37s).
• A survey was conducted to understand how people would categorize their subscription to The Verge, and the majority considered it a personal expense rather than a business expense (26m52s).
• The Verge did not want to charge hundreds of dollars per year, which is typical for subscriptions that are billed back to workplaces, as they wanted to target people who personally love the platform (27m2s).
• The price was determined by conducting competitive research, calculating the costs of running the platform, and considering the cost of turning off ads (27m48s).
• The annual subscription is significantly cheaper than the monthly subscription, and it also comes with exclusive magazine content (28m5s).
• The goal is to make The Verge a fun place to hang out online, in addition to its journalistic ideals, and to make it a part of people's regular budget (29m13s).
• The new website was designed to create a homepage that is fun to visit and refresh throughout the day (29m34s).
• The team's goal is to make The Verge a platform that people want to visit regularly, and to make it a part of their daily entertainment (28m45s).

Maintaining Journalistic Integrity (30m45s)

• Fundrise Venture Capital is considered one of the most lucrative asset classes, with nearly every tech company on the S&P 500 list once funded by Venture Capital firms, producing billions of dollars in profit in the process (30m49s).
• The biggest Venture funds are almost entirely funded by institutional investors, leaving individual investors out of the pre-IPO growth of blue-chip companies (31m6s).
• The Fundrise Innovation fund is changing this by offering a more than $125 million fund designed specifically for individual investors, holding some of the most exciting pre-IPO companies in the world (31m20s).
• Stripe payment management software handles the complexity of financial infrastructure, offering a seamless experience for business owners and their customers (31m54s).
• Stripe supports millions of businesses around the world, including companies like Uber, BMW, and DoorDash, and offers a suite of specialized features and tools to power businesses of all sizes (32m27s).
• Nei Patel, Verge editor-in-Chief, joins the conversation to discuss how things are made and how the world is thought about (33m19s).
• Nei is given the nickname "The Fire" and is expected to live up to the standard set by previous guest Helen, who called herself "The Firewall" (33m50s).
• The conversation with Nei will cover various themes and answer as many questions as possible, with the topics becoming more random as the conversation progresses (34m6s).
• A listener, Jessica from Massachusetts, expressed appreciation for the separation between The Verge's sales department and newsroom, and asked how the team will maintain journalistic integrity now that the team is aware of the sponsors for the Lightning Round segment (34m46s).
• Max wrote an email questioning why Nei keeps a firewall between the newsroom and ad team, but David is allowed to do ad reads for The Vergecast, and why that is considered acceptable (35m14s).
• The difference between Nei and David doing ad reads is that Nei is the one who has to maintain the firewall between the newsroom and ad team, while David's role as a producer and occasional voice on the show allows him to do ad reads without compromising the firewall (35m40s).
• Knowing who the Lightning Round sponsors are is not seen as a compromise of the firewall, as the team can see the advertisers on their website and it does not affect their coverage (36m1s).
• The rule is that the advertising team does not get to tell the news team what to do, and vice versa, which helps maintain the firewall and journalistic integrity (36m40s).
• The team is aware of the advertisers and assembles the whole product, including the Lightning Round segment, but the advertising team does not have control over the content (37m9s).
• The Lightning Round segment is new, and the team is still working out how to handle the sponsors, but they believe it is a familiar expression of the firewall and will not compromise their journalistic integrity (37m21s).
• The role of protecting the user experience of a website involves making decisions about what advertising is allowed, and this can sometimes put the person in charge at odds with the sales team, who may be pushing for more advertising revenue (37m32s).
• The separation between the editorial and business sides of the company is important, with the editor-in-chief and publisher having a relationship that includes a healthy amount of tension, which is necessary for maintaining a firewall between the two (39m21s).
• The firewall is not a physical barrier, but rather a separation of knowledge and influence, where the editorial side does not know the details of the advertising deals and the business side does not interfere with editorial decisions (38m9s).
• In the past, when printing magazines, the advertising was physically included in the magazine, and the editorial team had to decide where the ads would go, which sometimes led to accusations of bias (38m51s).
• The relationship between the editor-in-chief and the publisher is built on a foundation of old-school journalism, where the editorial and business sides are separate, and the editor-in-chief has control over the content (38m43s).
• The host of the podcast has less of a problem with podcast ads, and wants to discuss the issue further, as they see it as a gray area, whereas the separation between editorial and branded content is clear-cut (40m6s).
• The line between editorial and branded content is important, and the company does not make branded content, which is a clear and important distinction (40m14s).
• The host wants to press the issue of podcast ads, as they see it as a less clear-cut issue than the separation between editorial and branded content (40m1s).
• The approach to advertising in podcasts is different, with some hosts sharing personal experiences with products, which can be more expensive for advertisers, but this approach is not taken as it can be seen as less genuine (40m37s).
• A middle ground is taken where hosts read ads, which can be a common part of the podcast format and feels less intrusive than in other forms of media (40m59s).
• The decision to read ads is made on a case-by-case basis, and the advertiser must not be someone the organization would typically cover, with the goal of maintaining a clear separation between advertising and content (41m22s).
• Working with David Pierce can be challenging due to his willingness to take on a wide range of tasks, but this is also seen as a positive aspect of his work style (41m37s).
• The concept of nuance in journalism is seen as being lost, particularly among younger audiences who have grown up with influencer culture and may not understand the traditional separation between advertising and content (41m57s).
• The organization is rebuilding its ecosystem from scratch, with a focus on maintaining a clear separation between advertising and content, and this may involve being harsher in its approach to advertising (42m33s).
• The organization competes with creators who have decided that there is no need for a separation between advertising and content, and instead rely on their own internal guidelines to determine what they will and will not promote (42m40s).
• The organization's approach to advertising is seen as being very different from that of other creators, and this may lead to confusion among audiences who are used to a more blurred line between advertising and content (42m58s).
• The organization's subscription model is seen as a way to offer a clear and transparent approach to content, with the promise that the content will not be influenced by advertising (44m7s).
• The internet can destroy nuance, making it necessary to be harsher to preserve the clarity of a message, particularly when it comes to how journalism is made (44m18s).
• The goal is to focus on the journalism rather than over-communicating about advertising and its potential influence (44m51s).
• The publication is making a conscious effort to be transparent about its processes, which may seem excessive to some, but is necessary to counter the prevailing tide (45m19s).
• Traditional newsrooms may view this level of transparency as unnecessary, but it is essential for the publication's audience (45m31s).
• The publication's ethics policy was initially based on Walt Mossberg's policy at the Wall Street Journal and has since been iterated upon (45m42s).
• The journalism industry's failure to communicate how information is made is a significant issue, unlike other industries that often showcase their production processes (45m56s).
• The lack of transparency in journalism can be attributed to the industry's failure to effectively communicate its processes, making it essential for publications to be more open (46m15s).

The Value of Credibility in Journalism (46m16s)

• The New York Times is often presented as a credible source without being questioned, and this credibility is something that should be highlighted and communicated more effectively in today's media ecosystem (46m18s).
• Many creators on social platforms are powerful and influential, and they often discuss their methods and policies, which can make traditional media outlets seem less transparent by comparison (46m25s).
• Traditional media outlets can differentiate themselves by emphasizing their independence and adherence to established policies and standards (46m31s).
• New competitors in the media landscape are emerging with similar policies to those of established outlets, which is not entirely unexpected but still requires a strong response (46m40s).
• In order to effectively communicate their values and distinguish themselves, media outlets need to clearly and loudly draw lines and simplify their message for a modern internet audience (46m54s).

The Challenge of Ad Revenue (46m59s)

• The decision to not treat ad revenue as a sliding scale is a deliberate choice, as it can be a slippery slope that is hard to explain, and once started, it's difficult to stop (47m16s).
• Reading ads would generate a significant amount of money, and if the hosts were individual creators, they would personally benefit from it, but as a media company, the revenue is used to fund the newsroom (47m42s).
• The company's structure allows it to use the revenue to pay for the newsroom, which is essential for creating journalism jobs and supporting the work of the hosts (48m1s).
• The goal is to continue making journalism jobs and hiring young people to work in the newsroom, which has been possible due to the revenue generated over the past 13 years (48m19s).
• Making individual deals or trade-offs for more money could potentially destroy the core value of the newsroom, as seen in competitors who have made similar choices and no longer exist (48m36s).
• The hosts, including David, prioritize the value of the newsroom and the journalism jobs it creates over personal financial gain (48m9s).

The Role of Subscriptions (48m38s)

• The primary product being sold is credibility, and once it is lost, it is gone for good (48m40s).

Deciding Who Reads the Ads (48m49s)

• The decision to implement a subscription model was made to align the interests of the people consuming the content with those who pay for it, creating a more clarifying and helpful system (48m50s).
• This approach is challenging, and it means forgoing potential revenue from reading ads, but it's considered a cost too high to pay as it would lead to competing with others who might do worse things (49m22s).
• The more the company stays harsh and differentiated, the more stable the demand remains, with big brands wanting to buy advertising on the site because they know they can't buy the company (49m45s).
• Many companies want to come on the show Decoder because they know they can't tell the host what to do, and some want to prove to their teams that they can take the heat (49m59s).
• The podcast ecosystem is often criticized for being too branded and programmed, but this show is not, and its loudness about it has led to a long list of incoming guests (50m31s).
• Subscriptions are part of the plan to make the business healthy and resilient, diversify revenue, and ensure the company is still selling independence (50m47s).
• The decision to have Liam read ads is not explicitly stated, but it's implied that it might be to create some distance between the hosts and the ads (51m52s).
• The company's approach to ads is different from others, and it's something that the caller is considering as they start to think about paid partnerships and what that looks like (52m2s).
• The goal is to get more people's voices onto the show, and Liam is a character on the show who is a familiar voice but also the producer, which insulates him enough from the editorial process (52m5s).
• The reality is that the show would make more money if the hosts read ads, as that is what advertisers want - personal experience and host reads to trade on the trust listeners have with the voices they're hearing (52m38s).
• Advertising fundamentally works by having a trusted person sell a product, which is why random celebrities often sell products on TV, and this is not a moral complaint but rather how the industry works (52m53s).
• However, as journalists and product reviewers, it's essential not to endorse products, and the solution is to have Liam read ads without having editorial control or writing product reviews (53m27s).
• The rule is that Liam only reads the copy delivered to him, without any back-and-forth, to maintain a clear division between the editorial and advertising processes (53m57s).
• This approach is believed to match the experience of other podcasts and creates enough of a product for the sales team to compete in the market without causing downstream problems (54m16s).
• The goal is to maintain a clear division between the editorial and advertising processes, and feedback is welcome on whether this approach is successful (54m34s).

Behind the Scenes (54m49s)

• The concept of an "OnStaff influencer" is discussed, where the person lives on the hype desk, creates branded content, and is isolated from the newsroom to maintain a wall between the two, which is considered the loneliest job in America (54m49s).
• The idea of this job is to find ways to be competitive in the market while preserving credibility, but it's unclear if it will ever happen (55m12s).
• Liam mentions that he receives ad requests regularly, but doesn't communicate them to Nei or David, creating a boundary between the ads and the show's content (55m29s).
• Liam enjoys reading emails from people complaining about ads, which often informs him about who advertises on the show, and believes it proves that people can't tell the difference between ads and content (55m45s).
• The discussion touches on the idea that some creators, like Michael Fischer (Mr. Mobile), have laid out their ethics policies and are transparent about what they will and won't do, but still take money from brands (56m28s).
• The challenge of maintaining a clear ethics policy at scale is mentioned, with the need for simplicity and clarity for the audience (56m52s).
• A question from a listener is shared, asking what happens during ad breaks, and whether the hosts chat for a few minutes before resuming recording (57m9s).

Engaging with The Verge Community (57m28s)

• The Vergecast is not recorded in real time, and there are pauses in the recording that are edited out, with the hosts sometimes taking breaks and then resuming the conversation in the same breath (57m51s).
• Some people have requested a live, unedited version of the Vergecast, but the hosts believe it would be too much for listeners to handle (58m4s).
• The hosts compare the recording process to how Jeopardy is filmed, with multiple episodes recorded in a short period, which has ruined the show for one of the hosts (58m22s).
• The hosts discuss how they are not prone to believing in conspiracies, as they believe too many people would have to keep the secret, using the moon landing as an example (58m52s).
• The hosts joke about the secrecy surrounding Jeopardy, imagining a fully autonomous show with a room that is always recording (59m10s).
• The hosts warn listeners who enjoy The Great British Baking Show not to look up how it's made, as it may ruin the show for them (59m24s).
• A listener, John Ros, writes in to say that they loved the Vergecast more when it was concise and only had a Friday episode, but now there are too many podcasts to keep up with (59m40s).
• The hosts discuss how they think about the Vergecast now, with one host joking that their old episodes were not concise, referencing their "first album" as a quadruple-sided prog rock exploration (1h0m24s).
• The Vergecast team used to record episodes in a studio, leaving them physically exhausted, but now they appreciate the concision that has been added to their list of qualities, allowing them to be more focused and not cram every idea into one episode (1h0m40s).
• Having more episodes enables the team to be more focused and create products that can find their audiences, as different platforms, such as TikTok, homepage, and YouTube, have distinct content and audiences (1h1m7s).
• The Friday show has a big audience that doesn't want significant changes, while the Tuesday show is allowed to tell more narrative stories and build its own audience, providing a way for the team to grow their audience by offering different content (1h1m26s).
• The team's goal is to grow their audience, particularly new listeners, by providing focused stories that can bring them into the fold, rather than extracting more from their existing audience (1h1m58s).
• A listener, Leo, called in to ask about the Vergecast's theme song, which was redesigned and rebranded a couple of years ago but was later trimmed down, and the team explained that the change was made to match the YouTube and audio feeds (1h2m21s).
• The team plans to revisit the theme song and refresh it to make it less jarring, with the possibility of publishing the full theme song once a week or selling ads against it (1h3m28s).
• The revamped Vergecast theme song was created by Breakmaster Cylinder, who also did the Dakota theme song, and the original Vergecast theme was written by Josh Chowski (1h3m45s).
• The original theme song for the show was created by Josh using GarageBand overnight, but it was lost to the "Mists of Time" and had to be remade, providing an opportunity to create more content and improve the show's music beds and theme song (1h3m57s).
• The new theme song was created with the help of Breakmaster Cylinder, and it features a saxophone break that was specifically requested by someone on the team (1h4m29s).
• The team is happy with the new theme song, but they acknowledge that it may be too aggressive and could be used more often in the show (1h4m41s).
• The process of creating the new theme song was a good experience, and it allowed the team to work with Breakmaster Cylinder and create more content for the show (1h4m20s).
• The team also discussed the challenges of working with YouTube and its music policies, which can be frustrating and affect the show's content (1h5m5s).
• The show is sponsored by ServiceNow, an AI platform for business transformation that helps remove friction and frustration for employees, supercharge productivity for developers, and provide intelligent tools for service agents (1h5m23s).
• The show is also sponsored by Grammarly, a communication platform that delivers a consistent experience across an organization's ecosystem and helps teams work more efficiently and effectively (1h5m58s).
• Grammarly provides a range of benefits, including faster time to resolution for support tickets, less time spent writing sales emails, and potentially saving 19 days per year per employee (1h6m41s).
• The host of the show personally uses Grammarly for every email they send to guests, and they appreciate the peace of mind that comes with knowing they haven't made any typos (1h6m52s).
• The Verge redesign was a huge change that aimed to make the homepage more useful by aggregating content from other sources, similar to Ben Thompson's aggregation theory, and it has been over two years since the redesign was implemented (1h7m26s).
• The redesign was influenced by surveys that showed the most loved tech companies, such as Google and Amazon, were utilities that people used every day, and the goal was to make The Verge's homepage as useful as possible (1h8m55s).
• The idea is that by making the product more useful, people will come back, and this approach has been successful, with time spent on the homepage increasing by minutes, a number that is typically difficult to move (1h10m1s).
• The redesign has also led to an increase in the number of places to go and things to look at on the homepage, which has contributed to the increase in time spent on the site (1h10m12s).
• The concept of a homepage was once an open question, with some considering whether it was worth having and caring for, but The Verge's approach has shown that it can be a valuable part of the user experience (1h10m22s).
• The Verge is happy to link out to other sites, including competitors, and is exploring ways to make this process more seamless in a world with paywalls (1h9m45s).
• The success of the redesign has been influenced by the idea that sending users away to high-quality content can actually increase the likelihood of them returning to the site (1h9m36s).
• The importance of owning one's distribution is highlighted, as seen in the success of homepages and email newsletters, which allow creators to directly reach their audience without algorithmic interference (1h10m41s).
• This approach is valuable because it allows creators to showcase their work without external influence, and it is a trend seen in various media outlets, including newsletters and homepage redesigns (1h11m26s).
• A question from Clemente is discussed, asking if The Verge would ever consider publishing a print edition, similar to The Economist, which is admired for its print quality and art (1h11m45s).
• While there are no concrete plans for a print edition, the idea is not entirely ruled out, and it is acknowledged that creating a print product would require a significant amount of work and resources (1h12m7s).
• The possibility of starting with smaller print projects, such as zines, and building up to a larger print edition is considered, but it would require allocating time and resources away from other tasks (1h13m21s).
• The appeal of print media is discussed, including the desire to create print covers and layouts, and the enjoyment of reading physical magazines, such as The Economist (1h12m47s).
• The challenges of creating a print product from scratch are acknowledged, including the need to develop a new workflow and allocate resources, but the idea is not entirely dismissed (1h13m17s).